MKJ 
All right, CEO, Mr. Makers, welcome back to the conversation with my friend, Erin Hassan. Erin, welcome back. I cannot wait to dive into a little bit more about your previous experience, but this episode is about impact and innovation. So let’s start with who you want to impact. Each of our businesses, and that can be a particular industry, a particular avatar, however you would define that, but who are you trying to impact with your current gig, your current business?

Aaron Hassen
trying to help myself. Let me define that. Wait a minute. So, I started out as a founder, owned a company for four years and then sold it to a competitor and then got into marketing and led marketing programs for 20 years. And now, I’m at the head of H Marketing, which is a fractional marketing team for founders and revenue leaders that don’t have the time or the expertise to solve their marketing challenges. And that was me.

So I was a founder, I had issues and challenges, I couldn’t do it all. And I needed someone like me. And I didn’t want them just to come in and consult. No, I mean, that’s valuable for sure. Give us a plan, get us a line, that’s great. But then you need somebody to execute to make sure you get the results from all of that research and planning and things like that. So that’s.

That’s what we do at A .H. Marketing, our fractional team is, you know, we come in and do all the research in the background and, you know, understand the customer and the market and the competitors and the landscape, the category, all of that, do positioning and messaging and just get ready to go to market, develop the communications and the foundations, the technology, the tracking, all of that stuff. So then we can start running campaigns and

and actually driving leads and opportunities in the door, supporting the sales team. I needed all of that as a founder. I didn’t just need one piece. And I wanted to be able to hand it off because as a founder, what you want the most is to replicate yourself. You just don’t have enough time. And so it’s like, can I find somebody just like me? And I think that’s the differentiator for at least my businesses. They’re actually hiring.

a founder, somebody who gets it from their perspective and operates in a way that they would. And I call that marketing like an owner. So that’s what I do. I’m an entrepreneurial marketer and that’s just the way I see and view the world. And I think it’s what those founders and revenue leaders really need.

MKJ 
Yeah, yeah, I hear you. I think that is an amazing differentiator. Because what you’ve done is, is you’ve positioned yourself as someone just like them, but you can bring in that marketing piece that they can trust. Because you’ve done it before, just like they are doing it. But so that’s the impact. That’s awesome. Now tell me a little bit about the 20 years in corporate. How did that come into this? So you had your business, you sold it to a competitor,

Aaron Hassen 
Gracias.

Aaron Hassen
Yeah.

MKJ
then you went into corporate. What? What? Why?

Aaron Hassen 
I know, I was, as I was a founder, I really discovered that I love the marketing side. And I said, well, what better to do than to actually go help founders like me from the marketing side. And so I spent 20 years marketing for venture backed startups, a lot of Silicon Valley technology companies. These are like Y Combinator companies that…

have a lot of investment and need to grow fast. It’s a pressure cooker, there’s tons of pressure. The timeline is short, the runway is short in terms of investment. They’ve got to produce and they’ve got to produce now. It’s sort of an extreme environment to work in, but I learned to thrive in it. A lot of times I’d be the first marketer in. I would develop the strategy, the marketing program. We would go to market together with a small team.

have that initial success, find that product market fit, and then move to that next round of funding. And so, I did that for 20 years, had some major successes. And one company we went from 3 million to 65 million in four short years. We were acquired by the largest player in our space. It happened again when I went to another company. We

We were actually a single product focus. We were selling to major retailers like Under Armour, Michael Kors, GNC and all of that. And then we were end up being purchased by Klarna. So, you know, and it’s just those kinds of experiences have really influenced and informed, you know, how I make decisions and the way I view the world. And,

I’m somebody who gets results fast, who does things smartly, who remains efficient, is flexible, is ready to pivot, extremely resourceful. I spend their money like it’s my own. When I do invest, I invest for results. That is marketing like an owner. That’s the perspective I have.

MKJ 
Thank you.

MKJ 
Yeah.

Aaron Hassen
I think it’s the one that has made me and the companies that I’ve worked with so successful.

MKJ
Well, and you just basically put another notch on the trust belt right there because you were consistent from what you talked about in mindset, what you talked about at the beginning of this conversation, you want you market like an owner. And even through that 20 years, it wasn’t really corporate in that respect. If you were doing startups with venture, right, that’s different from Procter and Gamble or, you know, some some corporate entity.

Aaron Hassen 
The interesting thing, I’ll just interject real quick. The interesting thing is so many of these companies sold to enterprise. So I’ve sold to some of the largest companies in the world. We were selling to Delta and Coca -Cola. These are like Fortune 50s. And I had to learn the landscape inside those big enterprises. I mentioned the retailers we sold to, things like that. So although I was working at a startup,

you know, we were, I very much understand, you know, what’s happening at the corporate executive enterprise level because, you know, those were our customers and we had to understand them intimately and help navigate through those, you know, through that landscape in order to actually survive and grow as a business.

MKJ 
Yeah, definitely. But that again, that that whole trust factor just increased a bit because you, you were consistent. And you you basically saying, when you went into these startup environments, you treated it as if it was your money, you treated it as if it was your product, you, you were just as intimately acquainted with and caring about what you were doing, as the founder was. And, you know, I’m assuming you didn’t take a gig, if, if you didn’t align in that way,

Aaron Hassen
again that thing.

MKJ 
wasn’t just a job in that respect. Am I right?

Aaron Hassen 
That’s absolutely right. I love that you point that out because we talked earlier about the movie The 300 and the Spartans and how together when a team is aligned and going in one direction with a singular focus, they can really change the world. I think I was impacted by my Air Force experience and I went through leadership training in the Air Force and things like that and it’s just how I see the world. So as an entrepreneur,

I tended to want to go to market in the same way. And so when I would come on board, oftentimes there would be existing salespeople, maybe partnership people, product people, customer success. And I’m trying to figure out how I can align together with them so that we can go to market together. And this was 20 years ago. It’s now the trend. Everybody’s saying, how can sales and marketing align? How can we work as one team? I’m thinking…

We wouldn’t have survived if we didn’t work as one team. So, you know, I have a lot to offer in terms of recommendations and how that’s done. But yeah, it’s really informed the way I view the world. It happens to be the best way to work today.

MKJ 
Yeah, and that’s innovation, right? You’re not just opening up a book that’s all of a sudden on the new topic of, you know, fractional whatevers, fractional everybody’s, that’s really on the rise right now. Lots and lots of people are going in that direction. You didn’t just open a book and say, I’m just going to do a fractional thing, right? This is a natural progression of what you’ve been doing for 20 plus years.

Aaron Hassen
This is a national compression.

MKJ 
And in that mindset and all of your experience coming in, you are not, I mean, I wouldn’t even use that word fractional with you. Because it lumps you with all the other fractional people coming up behind you. I would really focus on your marketing like an owner.

Aaron Hassen 
I believe that there’s one truth that’s all together.

Aaron Hassen
I would really, really feel.

MKJ 
and we are your marketing team like an owner. And because that makes you the word that I’ve used and I haven’t heard it, I think I just made it up, un -competitionable.

Aaron Hassen 
Yeah.

MKJ 
right? There’s no way someone can compete with that because they don’t have your military experience and you’re starting your own gig and selling it and you’re working for 20 plus years with venture and bringing all of that because so nobody can compete with that. Let me finish that statement first before I say the next thought.

Aaron Hassen
If there’s no way someone.

Aaron Hassen 
works.

Aaron Hassen
and all of.

Aaron Hassen
Next part is…

MKJ 
And the next thought is, it sounds like the companies you work with now probably don’t have the venture capital that you worked with before. These are probably bootstrapped in many cases, companies. Is that true?

Aaron Hassen
It sounds like a company you should work with now.

Aaron Hassen
that you worked with before is are probably bootstrapped in many cases.

Actually, no. I have helped many of those. A lot of them have been on sort of a project basis. I’ll come in and help them with positioning and all that. But what I found success with, believe it or not, in our business, and it is a family business. My wife is a 16 -year marketer herself. I’ve got my 20 -year -old son helping us with graphic design and other things that he loves and enjoys.

and some other folks around to help us. But early on, yeah, I was helping similar companies, Silicon Valley tech companies, but we really found a sweet spot with those mid -market companies lately who have been around for a while. And so they really appreciate the value of marketing. They really understand it. The business has matured to the point where they’re not super desperate anymore.

there, you know, it’s, it’s just a different scenario. And I find that, I’m able to help them. Like for instance, I have this company I work with who serves, the event space and they work with the Hilton Hyatt and Marriott major conference hotels. These are some of the largest hotels in the country. They also work with major convention centers and they do technology like internet and digital signage and all of this. So there’s a technology spin there and.

And, you know, which is very familiar to me, but they’re working with these major enterprise brands, as I mentioned, very familiar to me, but they’ve been around 20 years. And so rather than two X and three X every year, which is what I’m used to, they’re actually growing at 30 to 40%, which is significant for a 20 year old company. And so I’m, I’m able to do for sort of a well established company, a mid market company, what we were doing with these startups using.

Aaron Hassen
startup principles because I think even enterprises would love to benefit from startup principles. So I take that to market, not just with those businesses that I’ve helped in the past, but with other mid -market companies and larger companies and we’re succeeding there too.

MKJ 
That’s fantastic. Yes. But what you’ve done now is taken that previous experience, taken that ability to go to market fast, understand all of the players, all of the information, and apply the strategy that you feel is best to help them reach whatever goals they have, whether it’s 30 to 40 % for mid -market or 2X or 3X for a startup. And you’re able to apply that.

Aaron Hassen 
Yes, what you’ve done now.

Aaron Hassen 
and all the strategy that you’ve been pressing on ever since you’re able to.

MKJ 
as a marketing, as an owner, but with all of that previous experience and showcasing that experience and say, if I can do this for this company, then I can do this for you as well. And that’s your innovation. That’s how you are. Again, nobody can compete with that. No one has that exact.

Aaron Hassen 
this for this company. I can do this.

Aaron Hassen
That’s how you are. Again, nobody can compare to that. No one has that exact combination of experience, knowledge, and understanding. I know data and all that is not a woo -woo thing. I’m not trying to make it a woo -woo thing. But it is an intuition.

MKJ 
combination of experience and knowledge and intuition. I know data and all that is not a woo -woo thing. I’m not trying to make it a woo -woo thing. But it is an intuition because of the previous experience you’ve had. I’ve seen this before. This is how it’s played out. Let’s try this.

Aaron Hassen 
See you later.

yeah, your instincts are born in your experience. And so, you know, it is very much based on, you know, what you’ve seen and done in the past. And I can tell you one of the things that has troubled me over time, because I love this profession. I got into this profession by choice, not by, you know, I…

I didn’t go the traditional route where I went to college, decided on my major, and then got into something I may not really love because I really didn’t understand. No, this is something I loved from the beginning, and I made a choice to get in and got my degree later. So it was kind of flipped in that way. And one of the things that’s troubled me over the last 20 years is just this decline in trust of marketers. So we see this in decreased CMO tenures.

There’s a recent Gartner study of 400 C -suite executives that found that 55 % of leaders felt marketing has an inflated view of itself and its importance. That drives me nuts. I look at the fact that of the four P’s that we learned in college, the product price, place, and promotion, how many of those are we actually trusted to lead anymore? It’s really just promotion.

You know, there’s something that’s happened over time in terms of our position as marketing leaders that really bugs me. And so I want to also help marketing leaders in how to approach things. Cause I do believe those founder CEOs, even your counterparts, your sales leader, your customer success leader, they’re looking for a partner. They’re looking for somebody they can trust. And to them, what a marketer means is that you know your customer and you know the market. Marketer.

Aaron Hassen 
It’s very definition is your knowledge of the customer and the market. And when we don’t come to meetings with knowledge of the customer and knowledge of the market, what’s happening, the trends, we’re not as valuable. And we start to lose influence. We start to lose their trust. And that’s the last thing that we need when we’re trying to do things that, and we’re trying to make investments and do things that might be slightly risky or we’re needing their trust. We’re needing their support.

the support of the investors, the support of the board, the support of your CEO. You can only get that if you come in, you know, ready to help and that means understanding the customer in the market. So, you know, as much as I want to help these businesses, I want to help our profession and other marketers out there as well.

MKJ 
You know, that is a perfect way to look at it. And I have a theory about that, because I agree 100 % with what you just said. The basically marketers are a sleazy word now. It’s just you just advertising to people, you’re just you’re just trying to capture and put them into buying and sell to them. It doesn’t feel good. And I think what we’re seeing is a pendulum swing. So we have the internet, there’s always been, you know, salespeople and

Aaron Hassen 
I think what we’re seeing.

of the internet has always been real.

MKJ 
and marketers who are trying to push people into that buying. But we’re seeing a pendulum swing with the internet where the massive amounts of access to potential buyers.

Aaron Hassen
But being a pendulum is a lot of work.

MKJ 
has basically dictated the way we communicate because of that immediate access. Instead of principles that we all know about relationships and trust, we didn’t need them, we being marketers, and companies, we didn’t need them with this massive access we had, we have. But now the pendulum is swinging and people are going, I’m done with this. I’m just marketed to you, I’m sold to constantly,

Aaron Hassen 
is basically dictated by the way we communicate. Because of that, we can access. Instead of principles that we all know about relationships and trust, we can access.

Aaron Hassen 
But now, people are going, I don’t like this.

MKJ 
people are bugging the hell out of me all over the place with texts and emails and DMs. And it’s like, go away. Stop. The only people I’m going to trust are my little whore. So now we’ve gone back to that localized, but it’s not location localized. It’s community localized. That localized trust. And we’re still marketing, or most people are still marketing to the masses rather than looking at that localized trust building.

Aaron Hassen
all over the place. Texts and… So go away. Stop. Not gonna trust our mind of horror. Now we’ve gone back to that localized…

Aaron Hassen 
community localized. That localized and we’re still marketing on those people. Marketing buses rather than looking at…

MKJ 
and relationship. And so it’s not new, we’ve had to do this forever. But now the pendulum is coming from this internet and this globalized audience that we have and potential buyers that we have. And I think marketers had those starry eyes that my gosh, the world is now my, my potential buyer, right? It’s

Aaron Hassen 
So it’s not new. I’ll try to do this forever.

Aaron Hassen 
I think marketers had those three I’s that, my God, the world is now much, right? Yeah. We used to have so much power. I mean, you think of the madman age and, you know, we could put things out there and say things and didn’t have to validate them. We’ve lost the power. The consumer has the power and there’s information parity, as you described. We all have the same access to information. Now with AI, I mean, we’re even, we’re smarter than we ever were. So.

If the idea as the marketer is, hey, I’m going to have something over you, no, that’s done. Your brand, if it’s anything, is what your consumer says it is and how they speak about you in the market. How do you influence in an environment like that?

You have to become more human. I’m thinking of the dating scene. Can you imagine if you use some of these practices when you’re trying to get a date? We have to become attractive to this potential suitor and marketers have to think the same way. We want to be somebody who’s trusted. We want to be attractive to the customer.

And we need to do so in a way that’s authentic, that’s trustworthy, that’s consistent, that’s appealing. And so, you start to go down track of doing things in line with treating others the way you want to be treated. So we get back to the golden rule.